Coaching KidLit Episode 48: Nature-Based Writing with Guest Erin Radniecki

[00:00:00] Sharon Skinner: Welcome to coachingkidlit.com, a podcast about writing and publishing. Good KidLit. We dig into various aspects of writing craft through a KidLit lens and provide inspiration and clear actionable items to help writers like you move forward on their KidLit writing journeys. I’m Sharon Skinner, author accelerator, certified book coach and author of Speculative Fiction and KidLit, including picture books, middle grade and young adult.

[00:00:30] Hello listeners. Welcome to Coaching KidLit. Today we have a very special guest for you, Erin Radniecki is a nature enthusiast and author accelerator, certified book coach based in Oregon’s, Willamette Rhymes with Damnit Valley. She helps nature, passionate people write fiction that makes readers care about the natural world. Erin pulls from her long journey of self-discovery to help anyone, citizen scientist, nature, professional, or passionate observer, tap into their love of nature and craft a story that will resonate with readers. When Erin isn’t reading, you can find her gardening for pollinators in her backyard. Welcome to the podcast, Erin.

[00:01:09] Erin Raniecki: Hi, Sharon. It’s so great to be here. Chatting with you today.

[00:01:13] Sharon Skinner: I’m excited to have this conversation with you. You’ve been on my list for a while to bring onto the show, so I’m very excited to get a chance to talk to you.

[00:01:22] Erin Raniecki: Thank you.

[00:01:22] Sharon Skinner: So tell us a little bit, Erin, about what brought you to this point where you are in focusing on nature and ecosystems and that sort of thing in writing.

[00:01:34] Erin Raniecki: Sure. So I think it really started as a kid. I was one of those kids that always liked the bugs and the critters in the backyard, and I was always into those little lives that are all around us that we don’t always see. And so as someone, a young person interested in nature, when you get to that age where people start asking you, well, what do you wanna do when you grow up?

[00:01:58] What do you wanna study in college? you get sent down this science path, which seems logical. I like nature, I like creatures, I like plants. I like the natural world. So science does seem like a logical next step as you’re are getting older. as something to study. And when I got to college, I found that.

[00:02:19] it wasn’t the right fit. I didn’t have the right kind of passion to be a scientist, a biologist, a entomologist, whatever it was that those classes didn’t hold my interest. So early on in my young adult life, I kind of had this little crisis of, well, I have this passion for nature, but I don’t have the passion for.

[00:02:40] The classes that I need to take, and I don’t think I have the passion to go down that career path well, so what do I do? And it took me a long time. Um, I’m middle age now. I’m in the middle of my career. And finally now have found. This pairing of my passion for nature and also my passion for writing and creativity.

[00:03:03] And so having those two things, figuring out, it took a long time. It took input from other coaches like you, that those things could go together and that could be my superpower is bringing those two passions together. And so I, really love the chance to get to say in a podcast or any setting, there’s no wrong way to channel your love of nature.

[00:03:25] And I’m a prime example of figuring out how to make it work. So that’s kind of how I got here, where I am today as a, book coach for nature, passionate people.

[00:03:36] Sharon Skinner: I love that you said there’s no wrong way to channel your passion for nature, because there’s also no real wrong way for channeling your passion for writing and your creativity. That goes so well together.

[00:03:48] Erin Raniecki: Right. Yeah. when we’re writing it. There are, gosh, you go to a bookstore, you go to a library. There are so many different types of books. There are books for every type of person. And yeah, there’s, outlets for creativity, outlets, for your passion, whatever it may be. And writing can be one of those outlets for you.

[00:04:05] It doesn’t have to be, In a lab or doing field work, or it could be writing, it could be creating art, it could be all sorts of things. And so I think it’s important for us to think broadly of how we can apply our passions in life and this is the way that I have figured out to do it, and it makes me really excited.

[00:04:22] Sharon Skinner: That’s awesome. Erin, lest people you are saying that you are coaching people who write about nature, Why don’t we dig into a little bit about, what that means for you when you’re coaching, nature curious individuals?

[00:04:38] Erin Raniecki: Sure. So I love the way you say it, you know, this, writing nature, this, tone of voice and it just paints this picture of I’m just writing beautiful descriptions and it can just go on and on and on. And that doesn’t work for me. And that’s not how I coach people.

[00:04:52] if you are someone who really likes lots of descriptions of nature, that’s great, but I’m the type of coach that’s going to kind of nudge you in different direction. And that’s because I think that , the key, the foundation, the meat of every story really gets down to the main character.

[00:05:09] And so when we’re talking about nature, I wanna know what does nature mean for this main character? What is your protagonist think about nature, and then what is their journey through the course of the story? So I like to talk about nature being more than scenery, more than pretty descriptions.

[00:05:27] And so I think it really boils down to what does it mean? Why is it important to your protagonist, which oftentimes means figuring out why it’s important to you as the writer.

[00:05:39] Sharon Skinner: I like that. Yeah. Because everything we do has a certain level of autobiographical information in it When we’re writing.

[00:05:47] Erin Raniecki: Exactly. It’s why when we talk about, why are you writing this story? Well, it’s gotta mean something to you. So yes, your, passion, your energy for it has to come across so absolutely autobiographical in some way to get your energy up to then give that energy to the reader.

[00:06:04] Sharon Skinner: And you are talking here really about the relationship of character to nature and or setting, or the ecosystem that. They’re in. So I know that you coach contemporary and some magical realism, and you wanna talk a little bit about the different genre and how nature fits into those.

[00:06:23] Erin Raniecki: Sure. So when we’re thinking about nature centered fiction, sometimes our brains can go straight to topics around, hot button issues or, climate change, these big kind of scary topics. And there’s certainly space for that in nature fiction. But it can just as much be about noticing the.

[00:06:45] The natural elements in your neighborhood and seeing what sort of a community that makes in your neighborhood. So when we’re, we’re looking at the different genres. Yes. I think in magical realism, maybe we’re getting, nature expresses a little more power than it can in our day-to-day lives that we see.

[00:07:03] And we can maybe take. Some of that frustration that we may feel, reading the newspaper, watching the news, seeing what’s happening out there. We can play around a little bit more and use some of that magical realism to kind of give nature a boost and show the world what we wish would happen.

[00:07:20] That’s very fun. And I, love reading and working with those types of stories. And if we’re talking about contemporary fiction. Maybe we are looking at how nature has helped someone as they grew up. Maybe talk about how it has influenced them as a person, influenced their journey in life. And that’s really why I focus on the protagonist and what their journey over the course of the story is.

[00:07:45] I love to see stories that involve a transformation. That either, that’s a transformation in how the protagonist is. Identifying with nature, or maybe it’s a, journey of how they’re willing to stand up and use their voice in support of nature. And those don’t have to be political or, really hard hitting type topics.

[00:08:06] That can happen with, small, quiet stories too, and that can show up in stories about relationships, stories about community. And I feel like when we talk about nature fiction, our minds tend to go in into a certain place. And really there are so many options that are out there.

[00:08:24] And your story can go in so many directions. It doesn’t have to be, , a heavy story. It can be a light happy story too. And so. I love all the different directions it can go. And I love talking with writers to help them think of their story, maybe going in a direction that they didn’t originally think teasing out, okay, well what if we went this direction?

[00:08:45] What if we went that direction? And seeing, what’s possible and then seeing how we can tie nature and those themes that we learn from nature back into the story.

[00:08:55] Sharon Skinner: So I’m thinking about the types of books that I’ve read that would be in that category or that would fit in with what you’re talking about. And the first one that comes to mind is, The eyes and the impossible, which is a middle grade. And I think that that one does an exceptional job of what you’re talking about.

[00:09:15] I also think though, that when we think nature-based fiction, a lot of times people’s brains are gonna go automatically to the conflict of protagonist against nature and that whole survival kind of thing. And yes, those are perfectly good novels. I mean, they’re great novels. it shows the human capacity for survival and how we can. Work with nature and not against it, but I don’t think that’s, the best example either. I think you’re talking more about the, quieter books here. There are a couple of picture books that I can think of,

[00:09:49] there’s one called Dark and Light by Dianne White, which is a bunch of children who go out at night with a flashlight and they go out and walk in the woods and they’re looking at Nature or Owl Moon by Jane Yolan, which is a classic, it’s a way old. But we still talk about it because it’s such a lovely book.

[00:10:07] But again, it’s about the journey out into nature and about the characters and what they’re experiencing. And I think really getting into that is what you’re talking about.

[00:10:18] Erin Raniecki: Right, exactly. Yeah. It’s getting into for young readers, it’s a sense of wonder. It’s a sense of, oh my goodness, all this diversity is around me all the time. And then as. We get into the, you know, middle grade and into ya. we add layers of complexity. Gosh, those middle grade readers, they love their animal facts.

[00:10:39] I have an animal fact kid in my house. I don’t even try and compete anymore. He, he is out, learned me in all those animal facts and then they start to get into an awareness of, the world that, we’re living in at this time. And so, yeah, if we’re looking at the different types of stories, yes, certainly we’ve got the survival stories, we’ve got Hatchet, and those types of stories.

[00:11:00] There’s humans against nature, but there’s also humans against, bigger powerful entities, be they human, be they not, and standing up for nature and saying, no, this is important for me. And I think when we start to get into middle grade, we see those themes a little bit more of, using our voice, , and saying this is important.

[00:11:20] And then when we get into, the young adult, age group. We see that even more So. I recently read The Invisible Wild by Nikki Van De Car, and it was set in Hawaii. I don’t read a whole lot of YA books because I have trouble finding ya books with the nature theme. Maybe I’m not looking in the right spots.

[00:11:40] But this one I, believe it was published in 2024. And it’s about the Menehune, which is, folklore peoples in Hawaii and it was a bit of a romance, but also about standing up and using your voice and saying. wait, stop, we need to rethink development because of course in Hawaii there’s all sorts of development for tourism and, different things.

[00:12:04] And then it also got into, identity and who gets to claim a certain identity. So it had some great themes And I really enjoyed the way that the author handled this tension, this, friction that we get when we’re talking about development of lands and balancing that with, care for the land and conservation of spaces for people to use. So that’s a book I highly recommend if you are looking for a YA book with a nature theme to it.

[00:12:33] Sharon Skinner: And you are also writing. Is that correct?

[00:12:36] Erin Raniecki: I am, I am just starting revisions of I’m calling it at the moment. We’ll see. It might change. Historical fantasy is what I’m calling it. We’ll see what I, land on when I, when I’m done. But it does of course, involve, some Anthropomorphic characters because I enjoy those.

[00:12:53] And a bit of history, but not enough to hit you over the head. I appreciate books that. give some history but still also keep it fun. I think you and I have both noticed, in the past that middle grade books have gotten pretty heavy, tackling some big topics and that’s great. I think it’s important to have those sorts of books out there, those sorts of conversations.

[00:13:14] But I think also readers sometimes just wanna go along on a fun ride, and I’m hoping, I’m hoping that that’s what I’m writing.

[00:13:22] Sharon Skinner: Well, tell me a little bit about how other than the anthropomorphic characters. How are you including your nature-based storytelling?

[00:13:29] Erin Raniecki: Right. So in mine I am, really trying to be accurate to the place where I’m writing. I’m trying to, be aware of and incorporate creatures that. That live in that space, in the real world, and also highlight the. strengths that they have, that moths have good camouflage or weasels are really good at squeezing into tight places.

[00:13:53] And so, that’s where I’m at. And then I’m pairing that with the themes of community and really of. Looking out for each other and everyone having a place, at the table, really having a space in the community. And so hopefully and hoping that, that, translates both for the creatures on the anthropomorphic side, but also to the humans that are kind of tangential in the story.

[00:14:19] Sharon Skinner: That sounds a little bit like, the sort of thing that we get from Kathi Appelt.

[00:14:23] Erin Raniecki: Yes. Yeah, hopefully. Boy, there are some, authors that you, don’t dare mention their name at the same breath as what you’re working on, but she’s someone that I aspire to write like, so yes, definitely good to have those people up there on a bit of a pedestal to, aim towards.

[00:14:38] Sharon Skinner: Yeah, it’s always good to know what we’re trying to accomplish and how it’s maybe similar or different from what has come before, which is why I always encourage my clients to read pro. Broadly and read voraciously so that they know what’s out in the world and they can find not only what they like, but what they don’t like, so they can emulate what they like.

[00:15:00] Erin Raniecki: For sure. and an important part of that to add is to. Take away the fear aspect. I know that when I was starting out with writing, I was really afraid to read things that were similar or in the same genre because I was afraid that I was going to find something that was just like what I was writing or feel that I was too influenced by it.

[00:15:22] And I think, that was a mistake at the time because really. I now understand just how, unique each of these books is to us as the creator, as the author. And I think you could give a room full of writers, a handful of prompts, and you were gonna get such variety, such diversity in what they would create or come up with that I think we really need to give ourselves as creators a lot of credit that we are unique and we make our stories unique when we’re writing. So yeah, don’t shy away from reading in your genre that you’re writing. Don’t shy away from reading good books because they will make your writing better. but there is. When you’re starting out a bit of a confidence issue, I know from my past.

[00:16:05] I don’t know. Maybe you’ve had a different experience, Sharon.

[00:16:07] Sharon Skinner: yeah, so for me, I’ve been a voracious and eclectic reader my whole life. I’ve always been reading two or three books at a time. Even when I was a kid, I used to hide so I could read. My mother would tell me to go outside and play, and I would drop books out the window and then.

[00:16:22] Head outdoors and go find another place to hide and read. So for me, reading broadly and reading, voraciously has never been a problem. I live, for words. it fills my soul, but it also fills the hopper. And I always talk about how for things to come organically out onto the page, it’s important for us to fill the hopper.

[00:16:42] So in your case, if you are working with someone who’s writing a nature-based story and. They are trying to get in touch with how their character feels about nature. Then they should go out into nature and touch and see and smell and feel all the things and see how, how it makes them feel.

[00:17:02] Erin Raniecki: Right. and then also when they’re out there seeing and touching and smelling and listening, ask themselves, how would their protagonist feel? Because maybe their protagonist has A different take on nature than they do, or maybe their protagonist changes their opinion of nature over the course of the story.

[00:17:21] Maybe they start out and they’re like, this is gross. I don’t wanna be here. there’s a bug on me. And maybe by the end of the story that’s changed a bit. So yes, I think it’s important to be out in nature and if you can, get out in nature in a place that’s similar to the setting of your book.

[00:17:38] It’s not always possible, but then also think about what does that mean? What is your character taking away from their time in nature?

[00:17:46] Sharon Skinner: And it’s a perfect example of how we can take another technique from acting method acting and use it in our writing. So when we go out and we are getting that sensory feel and we are getting that visceral emotion and reaction to something, that’s something we can use in our own work to get that emotion on the page, to get that.

[00:18:07] Sensory detail on the page, and that’s really important in order to allow the reader to immerse into the story and be totally engaged.

[00:18:16] How else can we connect nature into our writing? So even if I’m not writing a nature based story, how do you recommend that other writers use that aspect of writing in their work?

[00:18:30] Erin Raniecki: If you’re not writing what you would consider to be a nature centered book, there are still ways that you can include nature in your story, and I think one of my favorites is to use it as a metaphor for some theme that you are hoping to weave into your story.

[00:18:46] Nature is full of great metaphors, and I think finding something that can follow your protagonist through the story and reflect what their experience is or what it is they’re needing to learn throughout the story, nature is a great way to do that. and that allows you to add some nature elements without totally diving in headfirst, into nature fiction.

[00:19:10] If that doesn’t feel authentic to you.

[00:19:12] Sharon Skinner: That’s a great recommendation. As long as we stay away from things like a dark and stormy night

[00:19:17] Erin Raniecki: Right.

[00:19:17] Sharon Skinner: So finding ways to use nature as a metaphor and or thematically or to reflect or contrast with the protagonist’s mood or emotional state. that’s something I talk about a lot when I talk about writing through character lens.

[00:19:33] Because when you look outside and the birds are singing and you’re in a good mood, yay, that’s lovely. But when you look outside and the birds are singing and you’re in a bad mood, that is not so lovely and that’s not how you see it. You don’t see things the same. So when your character, your protagonist, or any of your characters are viewing nature, that’s a good way to.

[00:19:54] Inform us as the readers of what they’re feeling and, what they’re sensing by how they see what’s going on in the world around them.

[00:20:03] Erin Raniecki: Absolutely. And I think if you’ve got. A protagonist who normally loves nature and is having a bad day. Yeah. It’s totally fine for them to, have trouble seeing the good in this thing that they love. I have that problem all the time when I look in my backyard and I see deer and they’re eating my flowers, right?

[00:20:21] So we can, we love nature and your protagonist can love nature, but it’s okay to have a bad day with nature that’s part of the journey too.

[00:20:28] Sharon Skinner: I feed the birds in my yard and there are days when it’s like, oh, this is so lovely because the love birds are here and the finches are here. But when the pigeons come, I have to remind myself that they are birds too, and they’re part of nature, and some of them are very, very pretty. They just have a bad rep.

[00:20:44] Erin Raniecki: Right. Yeah. that’s something that I have to remember too, is that if I’m putting out food, I’m putting out food for whoever comes, I don’t get to. Have a bouncer at the gate and say, you get in and you don’t.

[00:20:56] Sharon Skinner: Yeah So what else would you like to impart to our listeners while we’re having this conversation?

[00:21:02] Erin Raniecki: I would like to make the case that nature has a place in your story, be it small, be it large, and especially when we’re talking about KidLit, I think including nature. It’s going to have a great return on your writing investment because I hang out in the middle grade world at the moment.

[00:21:24] That’s the age of my eldest and. I go to these, nature Day camps and I see just how much energy and excitement there is and how much wonder. And so I would encourage you, even if you don’t identify, as really a nature passionate person. See if you can find a way To weave that in because I think young people, in that middle grade age especially, are so passionate about it and just the idea that nature is around us and it is like going on every day doesn’t matter what we humans are doing.

[00:21:56] We’re very impressed with ourselves, humans, I think, and to look around and say, wow, like there are lives happening. Thousands of them, millions of them all around us every day, and we aren’t paying attention and look at the amazing things that they do. And I think that sort of energy really can infuse and pull in readers into your book.

[00:22:17] So I hope that writers consider that. And if they have an aspiration to do that and they need help getting there, hey, let me know. Gimme a call. I can help you figure out a way to connect that to your story.

[00:22:29] Sharon Skinner: Yeah, I’m glad that you mentioned that because I’ve realized that we have walled ourselves off from nature, literally with our homes and our buildings, and we’ve pushed nature out further away from us and some of us try to bring it back and have yards and feed birds, I’m very protective of my carpenter bees.

[00:22:48] Most people don’t like carpenter bees, but they’re super pollinators and I’m super protective of the ones that live in my backyard. They’re not living in the wood of my house. I’ve given them a place to live and they are very happy and I’m happy that they’re there. They make me happy when I see them. And, recently my brother acquired A beehive and his neighbors had bees in their shed, and so they were able to transfer those bees over to his house. these are ways that we do connect, but for the most part, especially here in Arizona, we get up in the morning, we get in the car, we go to work, we get out, we get straight into work.

[00:23:23] We don’t spend time outdoors in the summer because it is. Ugly out there and we’ve cut ourselves off in so many ways from nature, and I have to drive to go to the Desert Botanical garden or To get out into nature or to hike on a trail or to see trees. I have to travel quite a ways because we’ve really locked ourselves in.

[00:23:46] Erin Raniecki: Exactly, and I, think communities handle this differently, and especially as communities grow, That can be a, place of tension, where nature is butting up against what communities or city councils or whoever wants to do. I feel very fortunate to live in a, city where.

[00:24:04] We do have some wild corridors, and people care about the wildlife that is living in those spaces. So we have, a federally protected wetland, just a small one within a park. And there are beavers in there. The beavers like to build dams in the winter.

[00:24:18] They start to flood an adjacent parking lot and it’s. Very interesting to me to see how the community can see both sides. They can see that, yeah, we don’t wanna be flooding the, adjacent buildings, but these beavers are doing what beavers do and we live in the beaver state. and that’s the mascot of our university.

[00:24:38] And really encouraging and wanting to see a way that we can live together in this space. And the city has found a way to make it work. and I think that that is a great story and a great example. Think of someone who lives in a place where they don’t have those sorts of examples. To read that kind of story in a book and say, oh, here’s a story where there was conflict and a community.

[00:25:02] Found a way to, to make it work with the creatures that are in their space and that they’re sharing space with, that’s could be a powerful thing for someone to read and especially if they’re living in a place where, that kind of thinking is not the norm. And that’s why I wanna see more of these kinds of books out there.

[00:25:18] because what seems logical in my backyard, in my neighborhood is not going to seem logical or doable in other parts of the country, other parts of the world. And so to have an example to be able to say, look, look, this is possible. I think that’s empowering, especially for young minds as they’re looking at how they’re going to fit into it.

[00:25:39] The adult world as they grow and what role they can have to, have a positive impact.

[00:25:44] Sharon Skinner: that’s a great point. We do have, a riparian area here, not too far from me. Still gotta get in the car and drive over there, but it’s lovely. I don’t go there in the summer though because it’s 118 degrees out. not my kind of weather for taking a walk even near water.

[00:26:01] Erin Raniecki: I’m not sure how you do it, sharon.

[00:26:03] Sharon Skinner: Well, it’s what I tell people is that here in the desert we’re just opposite. if I lived in Nebraska or someplace like that, then I would go from the house to the car. From the car into work. or into the grocery store or what have you. In the wintertime, I wouldn’t spend a lot of time out there ’cause it’s. Extreme weather, but here in the desert, we do that in the summer and then we have these lovely mild winters, which is why we put up with it is so that we can have these lovely mild winters because some of us just don’t like The other extreme,

[00:26:34] Erin Raniecki: Yeah, well there is a place for all of us and in my neck of the woods we have the, really gray, really rainy winters. but we put up with that so that we have our lovely green, springs and summers, so we have all of our forests around us, and yeah, it’s, you put up with the, the good, with the bad, I suppose.

[00:26:54] Sharon Skinner: Yeah, there are very few places that are perfect when it comes to nature and most of those places people have moved in and they’re no longer perfect.

[00:27:03] Erin Raniecki: We have a way of, making the perfect imperfect sometimes.

[00:27:06] Sharon Skinner: Yeah. And I mean, San Diego’s beautiful, but I don’t wanna live there because there’s way too many people there.

[00:27:12] Erin Raniecki: yeah, my husband and I lived in San Diego for two years, and there were. were amazing things about it. but ultimately, I was ready to come back to the Pacific Northwest with our four seasons and a little bit more space, between us and everyone in the neighborhood and I didn’t understand the concept of a sense of place and being in the right place until I moved away from where I am. I grew up in the Pacific Northwest. I’ve lived here my whole life. Except for those two years in San Diego. and I understood finally what it meant to be a fish out of water, because I really felt like I wasn’t a whole person anymore, when I was out of my element.

[00:27:47] Sharon Skinner: Well, and I think sense of place is a perfect point to make when you talk about using nature in story. So I think you’ve kind of brought it back full circle to how do we use nature in story? Well, that sense of place and how important it is and how comfortable we are or are not in that sense of place. Nicely done. as you know. We always try to give an action item for our listeners, what have you got for our listeners today?

[00:28:12] Erin Raniecki: So I have something that I’m really excited about and it’s brand new for me. I have made a free story, ecosystem starter kit, so if you are just starting out with a story idea. And you are looking to grow it, and you’re looking to maybe have a bit of a nature lens, maybe not. I think that the starter kit works, whether you’re writing a nature centered, novel or not, but over the course of four days, helps you define what I think are the five most important elements of story and talks about how they interact with each other.

[00:28:46] in the same way that elements of an ecosystem interact. So I would love for people to visit my website and download that and let me know. I’m excited about it. I think it’s really cool. I would love to see what other people, what their take is. So yeah, please check it out.

[00:29:02] Sharon Skinner: And that website is writewithnature.com.

[00:29:05] Erin Raniecki: And you can find the starter kit at writewithnature.com slash starter kit.

[00:29:10] Sharon Skinner: Alright, for my, action item, I’m gonna go back to this whole idea of getting outside and getting that sensory detail that. Understanding of nature that you can then use in your writing. So basically, I’m gonna tell people to go hug a tree.

[00:29:28] Erin Raniecki: Awesome.

[00:29:28] Sharon Skinner: I’m a big tree hugger. I’ve, loved trees all my life.

[00:29:31] I’ve had this thing about trees all my life. And so my recommendation is get outside, stop, pay attention. Look at the greenery even if you’re just walking from one place to another, if there’s a tree or a plant or a flower, Don’t just walk by. Stop. Take a moment. Take it in. I know we’re in a hurry all the time.

[00:29:51] We’re always going from place to place. So even if you don’t have time to go drive to the riparian or get outside in the forest or what have you, there is nature outside everywhere you look and just pay attention to it. Take a moment. Do this zen thing, be in the moment and take it in because again, you’re filling the hopper for later.

[00:30:12] you want that to organically come out on the page, and again, like you said, think in terms of, okay, this is how it feels for me. How might it feel for my protagonist? how might they see this through character lens?

[00:30:25] Erin Raniecki: Exactly, and as you’re taking those moments outside, it could even just be walking from your house to your, car or the car to the office. I guarantee you are passing small creatures, small lives. as you’re going to and from on your busy day, and yeah, just taking us a moment to pause and to look and to put your phone down.

[00:30:46] Isn’t that hard to do sometimes, but we can’t notice what’s around us if we’re plugged into our busy lives. And so I definitely encourage people to take a moment, let your eyes rest on a place, and then see. Is it something moving? Because oftentimes there’s a little, little bug or something crawling around in there.

[00:31:05] There’s a life happening, it may not be a big flashy life, like humans try to live, but it’s a smaller, quieter life that, gosh, darn it isn’t hurting anyone and is living in part of an ecosystem where it has an important role. And I think there’s a lot for us to learn from that.

[00:31:21] Sharon Skinner: So when you talk about sense of place earlier, one of the things that happened to me is I was raised in Northern California and when I got out of the military, I was in the Navy and I came out for a job. I came out to Arizona, and when I first got here, there was. Shock and awe because I was like, there’s nothing, nothing’s alive, nothing’s green.

[00:31:41] People had gravel in their yards and they painted it green. I was so freaked out and then I started to get to know the desert and I started to see the flora and the fauna and all of the life in the desert, and that was one of those moments where. It took me some time to step back and look and really see what was out there

[00:32:02] Erin Raniecki: Sharon That sounds like a story. There’s a transformation there. If you’re the protagonist, you came in with one mindset, and over time you saw that, things were not as, you originally thought that they were. I.

[00:32:12] Sharon Skinner: Absolutely. Yeah. Well, Erin. this has been a pleasure and a joy and I’ve learned so much about nature-based writing. I’ve downloaded the story ecosystem from your website so that I can. Play in that and see how that will inform my own writing. So I’m excited to step into that. But where else can we find you online?

[00:32:33] Erin Raniecki: So my website is writewithnature.com. My Instagram handle is also writewithnature., I have posts, a couple times a week, but really where I’m active is in the stories and that’s where I put all my pictures that I take as I am out and about going on walks.

[00:32:49] If I see something that I think is cool or beautiful or sometimes creepy, depending on, you know, spider caught, something in its web, whatever. Yeah, I like to share those on stories so. If you like a little bit of a nature, hit in your scroll. Check me out.

[00:33:04] Sharon Skinner: Thanks again for being here. I’ve just really enjoyed talking to you at any point in time, but this has been exciting for me because I know that our listeners are gonna get so much out of hearing you talk about your story ecosystem starter kit and the way that you approach nature-based writing.

[00:33:23] So thank you so much.

[00:33:25] Erin Raniecki: Thank you so much for having me on. I love the chance to talk about nature and writing all the time, and we always have such great conversations, so thank you.

[00:33:34] Sharon Skinner: Bye for now.

[00:33:35] We hope you’ve enjoyed this episode of Coaching KidLit, a writing and book coaching podcast for writers who want to level up their KidLit game. For more episodes, visit coaching KidLit dot com and to find out more about what a book coach could do for you, visit my website, book coachingbysharon.com.